Too many networks

[al5001] · Guest

Ok guys theres way too many networks. Why isn't there more people linking servers instead of making more networks?

What if you link more than one network together so each hub keeps its own domain name but the leafs in the hubs share it's hub's domain name?

U · Eleet Joined: 18 Jun 2003 Posts: 521 Location: IRC

Because everyone wants to be the boss, if you link to someone else, you share that role at a minimum, or you are under someone else and go by thier rules.

People don't want to do that-so they start their own Smile

arrquko · none Joined: 26 Oct 2003 Posts: 26

The reason I dont like to link to servers is because then we have to conform to their rules. And most networks dont have the same outlook as we do. I like servers to link to me because that away our laid back server can remain laid back. Most networks have a rules list longer than my arm. Most people know what is right and whats wrong. But for the newbies we still provide adequte help. But we dont demand that in the /rules. Its listed on the networks website. Another reason why i dont want to link to a server is because some servers are now doing that "only the people that made the network can have NetAdmin" . Im sorry but if im hosting the server and compiled it and everything then I should be able to have the Status of NetAdmin. I treat the servers that link to me like they founded the network. Because withouth linked servers there is no network, only a stand alone server.

Just my view on things.

Wiggle · Newbie Joined: 01 Nov 2003 Posts: 81

Which is why IRCd's such a bahamut and hybrid are wonderful Smile

. - They don't have 547 different access levels.

Though there'll still be the discussion about services administrator access, etc Razz

.

[al5001] · Guest

I was actually thinking of using Hybrid without a NickServ/ChanServ/MemoServ.

One of the problems when servers delink is reregistering nicknames and channels.

If your server just runs a BotServ server (which doesn't exist but I'm looking for someone to help code one) then you could just use bots to stay in channels 24/7 and have users identify to the bot to get op. Of course channel takeovers might happen, however thats why you don't op untrustworthy users in your rooms.

I considered the GNUworld IRC Operator Channel Services bot aka "X" on undernet and "Q" on quakenet, however there is only one! I am thinking of a botserv that has bots which set channel limit every so many seconds, and that has a few IRC games on them, but IRC Ops would have to enable the games for each channel.

This way you won't need to use extra background processes for each bot like Eggdrop.

If you need to send memos to everyone in your channel, then use a newsflash thing on your bot.

If you need to send a message to an offline user, email them, and you won't be wasting any of your server bandwith Razz

U · Eleet Joined: 18 Jun 2003 Posts: 521 Location: IRC

The bottom line is-everyone will have their own opinions on how to run a network, and unless you totally agree with it, you'll have to run your own to get it ran your way Smile

AshleighJane · none Joined: 23 Jan 2004 Posts: 40

Having spent last week when I had time online to do so, I read with alot of interest the site,

"A guide to starting your own IRC network" by Ashen.

http://www.moonlightglade.net/~ashen/irc/AG-setup.txt

(3.1) Users
Make sure you have at least 30 users, and at least 3 staff (opers/admins/etc)

Too true, I could'nt agree more with them words, their are far too many networks with a poor user count, also taking into account the pending networks too, its a never ending story. Some, and Im not saying everyone wants that power control in setting up their own network regardless of what experience they have / if none at all and I have seen network owners with no experience of commands, one didnt know how to /admin chat...sheesh let alone anything else.

It has often be said to me, why dont I start my own network, financially I could, of which I have replied with maybe one day, I have looked at all the possibilities, I have aol hosting / lineone chat hostess experience from having regular users in numbers 60plus in a room, with 5 years on IRC. I have been a helper learning everything and being taught same from experience ppl, then moving to IRC oper & server admin, so I have gained some of the experience needed, but what is stopping me. Its the amount of time that I would have to put in having my own network and I just hav'ent this amount of time to spare and I think others should consider this before starting your own network. If you have a busy offline life, and if you can only give 20-30 hours to online weekly then its not worth considering having your own net its just sheer madness even with a small user count of say 5 you will struggle.

Everyone is looking for links, thats the fashion on IRC, you link to us, but we dont want to link to you, you use our services, and so it just repeats itself in the Linking Power Game.
however any small user network should consider linking, like it just needs about 5 servers becoming one network and if you have a 20-40plus users that is a better start, than being on your own and struggling to get the users.

Thanks Ashen for putting that site together, you have a 5 star rating from me, it certainly
has made me stop and think from reading between the lines.

Jane X X

Dr-Voodo · Eleet Joined: 07 Nov 2003 Posts: 535 Location: IRC

The reason why I started my network was not because I wanted to be the boss, I was linking to a lot of places but it ended up that I didn't like the way they worked and their rules so I thought the best thing was to make my own network, not because I wanted to be the boss or not because I wanted to have my own rules or not because I wanted to get a big network but just because of fun and I really enjoy my network. I think the main reason why people choose to make their own network is because they want their own rules, a place that belongs to them and because they enjoy what they are doing.

Max_Man · Newbie Joined: 23 Oct 2003 Posts: 67 Location: IRC

everyone has likes and their dislikes

some like Q and X and L

some like Srvx

some like unreal ircd
some like ircu

one network having it all seems like a good idea but would be very hard to pull off

w00t · Posted: Aug 12, 2004 5:56pm Post subject:

Personally, I want somewhere to play around with stuff Smile

If people want to chat there, fine and good. I'll do stuff to help them. But primarily, I program odds and ends for fun, and since I help run a net, well I program for that net! Makes sense...

shamrock · none Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 25

There should be only one Network Administrator. That would be the person who owns the Domain and controls the Domain Servers. That does not mean the Network Admin has to be the boss, however. More of a figurehead at the top like a Head of State. Simple voting protocols can eliminate the boss syndrome.

Ashen · Idler Joined: 05 Jan 2004 Posts: 284

Thank you AshleighJane. I'm going to include your comments about power versus time comittment in the next version of my guide.

If anyone else has any helpful suggestions for material to include in the guide, let me know and I will refactor them in.

With regard to my own personal reasons for starting a network, they were:

1) I saw the oppertunity to create a network on a topic for which there were no existing networks! (I later found out there was one, but it only had 130 average users.... at the moment, we've gone from nothing to challenging it)

2) I saw the oppertunity to work with very good, experienced admins who have been running irc servers/networks for years and who I could trust to help me run a high quality network.

3) I saw the oppertunity to merge several smaller nets into something more efficient.
We had the usercount for a substantial network, only it was split across many servers. I formed my network my merging several smaller networks into one network, under my management. This meant that we all gained (less overhead, more users who shared our interests, better rank in search engines and indexers), and we grew much faster then any of us could grow by starting our own network with 0 users to start with.

4) I could easily afford the costs in terms of time/money, and wanted to learn more about IRC in general by running a small network, as I have had years of oper/admin experience on other networks.

5) I wanted to contribute to the IRC community by creating a network of high quality.. as I saw most networks out there were simply not up to my standards.

I run bahamut on my network, so we don't have 'network admins', we have services admins - of which there are only two (including me - where both of us have been admins for many years and so both experienced and know how it goes). We have about 95 users, no warez, no porn, no nastyness generally, and we manage this fine with only 5 staff. (quality, not quantity!)

I've tried running networks democratically before, but I found that personally, I find a meritocracy more effective.

When you start to invest the amount of time and money required to make an IRC network a success, the thrill of being "the boss" wears off very quickly........ you have to genuinely enjoy the work you do, or you will quickly get fed up and your network will suffer or die.

Often politics are the hardest part of getting an irc network started (as in, getting everyone together and agreeing on how things are run) - which is why the O:line flags, services access, and who owns the domain/services/hub shell are often such big issues.

I try to grow my network by focussing on quality of user experience first. Everything else is secondary. I also think that the ircd and services you use are a LOT less important the quality of your staff.

I agree there are too many badly run networks (0 is the ideal).... however I do not agree there are too many IRC networks.
The fact there are so many is a good thing because they will compete so hard for users. Because of this competition, the quality of the networks will increase, as each network tries to attract users, and the end result of this is that IRC will be more user-friendly and give a better user experience. Thus, the more networks there are, the more competition there is, and thus there is an increase in quality that benifits users.